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Pension Advisory Com~ittee
j Minutes
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Also Present: Leslie Dougall-Sides
Richard H. Ebetke
Patricia O. Sullivan
Assistant City Attorney
Interim Director Human Resources Department
Board Reporter
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PENSION ADVISORY COMMITTEE MEETING
CITY OF CLEARWATER
September 10, 1998
Present: '
Rita Garvey .
, J. B. Johnson
Robert Clark
Pat Greer
Pat Shepler
Dick Fitzgerald
John Scacca
Chair/Mayor - arrived 9:03 a.m.
Vice Chair/Commissioner
Committee Member/Commissioner
Committee Member
Committee Member
Committee Member
Committee Member
The Vice Chair called the meeting to order at 9:02 a.m. at City Hall.
To provide continuity for research, items are in agenda order although not necessarily
discussed in that order.
ITEM #2 - Approval of Minutes
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Member Fitzgerald moved to approve the minutes of the regular meeting of the
August 13, 1998, as recorded and submitted in written summation to each board member.
The motion was duly seconded and carried unanimously. .
ITEM 113 - Emplovees to be Heard - None.
ITEM #4 - Action Items
a) Review and Action on Employee Requests for Years of Service Pension
1. Charles D. Daniels - Firefighter/Driver-Operator, Fire Department
2. O'Neal Larkin, Jr. - Tradesworker I, Parks & Recreation Department
Member Greer moved to approve a Years of Service Pension for Charles D. Daniels
and O'Neal Larkin, Jr. The motion was duly seconded.
In response to a concern, it was noted retiring employees are provided an estimate
of their benefits. The date of retirement affects the amount.
Upon the vote being taken, the motion carried unanimously.
b) Review and Action on Employee Requests to Vest Pension
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1. Victor C. Chodora - Central Permitting Assistant Director, Central Permitting Department
Victor C. ChodorB has resigned his position after being employed by the City for
more than 14 years. He will qualify to receive his reduced pension beginning March 01,
2006.
AND.
2. Ralph Rodriguez-Torrent - Gas Supervisor, Gas Department
Ralph Rodriguez-Torrent ~as resigned his position after being employed by the City
for more than 18 years. He will qualify to receive his reduced pension beginning November
1, 2008.
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In response to a question, Interim Director Human Resources Department Richard H.
Ebelke stated these employees' pension plan benefits are based on the normal formula.
Member Johnson moved to approve the requests by Victor C. Chodora and Ralph
Rodriguez-Torrent to vest their Pensions. The motion was duly seconded and carried
unanimously. .
c) Approval.of New Hires as Pension Plan Members
Member Johnson moved to accept the following employees into membership in the
Pension Plan:
Date of Pension
Employment EIiQ. Date
Scott Yates, Systems Analyst/Program. II Information Management 08/17/98
08/17/98
08117/98
08/17/98
08/1 0/98
08/17/98
Jade Weppler, Maintenance Worker II
Mark Parry, Planner
Frank Dixon, Solid Waste Worker
Mirjana Zdjelar, Accounting Clerk
Parks & Recreation Dept. 08/17/98
Central Permitting Dept. OBI1719B
Solid Waste Department 08/10/9S
General Services Dept. 08/17/98
The motion was duly seconded and carried unanimously.
ITEM #5 - Pendino/New Business
a) Discussion of Member Shepler letter re: Retirees older than 65
In his August 12, 1998, letter, Member Shepler requested the PAC IPension
Advisory Committee) review the Pension Plan's "Table of Reduction Factors" for validity
. . and fairness as it relates to employees older than 65 who have less than 20 years of
service at retirement. Member Shepler stated seasoned employees bring expertise to the
City. As the population is aging, he felt the Pension Plan should be modified to attract
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Assistant City Attorney Leslie Dougall-Sides said the tables are part of the Pension
Plan. This is not a new issue. Mr. Lockwood said staff had not been advised during
negotiations that the actuarial tables included a 70% downward adjustment. Information
was requested on the feasibility of allowing older employees to contribute to Social
Security rather than the Pension Plan. It was suggested this may be a union negotiation
issue. Mr. Lockwood noted SAMP employees do not have a bargaining agent.
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older employees. Concern was expressed staff had not provided board members with any
materials regarding this issue.
Administrative Support Manager Robert Lockwood said the Pension Plan provision
that offers actuarially reduced pensions to older employees is unfair and violates Pension
Plan rules requiring a uniform procedure for all groups. He said retiring employees who
cash in their pensions lose the City's contribution and a fair dividend. He reviewed the
annual retirement benefit of a hypothetk~~l employee who retires after 10 years of service
at age 65. According to the eX!'lmple, :.-t"iested retirement benefit is reduced by an early
retirement factor of almost 70%. The ex"ample bosed a 10-year pension accumulation on
employee and City contributions earning 7% interest. Mr. Lockwood said the actuarial
equivalency is a culprit. As employee membership in the Pension Plan is mandatory, he
said seniors help subsidize the plan. The firefighter plan does not have similar restrictions.
He said firefighters who retire after 20 years of service before age 55 are not required to
accept actuarjally reduced pensions, even though the eventual pay~out is greater.
Mr. Lockwood said the PAC (Pension Advisory Comittee) is responsible for
addressing plan inequities regarding the treatment of retirees. He said the current policy
will have a negative impact on the City's future labor force. Member Greer reported she
had a copy of a letter from a former City employee stating she had quit due to this issue
and now works in the private sector. Mr. Lockwood recommended the PAC be proactive in
addressing this unfair practice which might be discriminatory. He said senior retirees
should be able to recoup their contribution, the City's contribution, and the interest.
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Member Shepler requested the issue be researched and inequities changed. It was
noted Social Security is discriminatory. Workers who contribute during their career receive
only a $200 burial allowance when they die. Retirees are not credited for employer
contributions to Social Security. Mr. Lockwood said this issue affects widows and others
forced into the workforce late in life.
It was requested staff provide a comparison of the Pension Plan with Social Security
benefits that also indicates how spouses are compensated. It was noted many local
employers do not offer a comparable benefit package. It was stated older workers increase
the cost of the City's health insurance coverage.
Member Greer moved that an actuarial study consider the impact of the plan if
actuarial equivalents are discontinued. The motion was duly seconded.
It was felt the PAC needs more information before investing in actuarial services.
Concern was expressed regarding the fairness of the issue.
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Member Greer withdrew the motion. The seconder indicated he would withdraw his
second if the PAC commits to evaluating this issue and roviewing problems related to the
actuarial tables. Information from the Legal and Human Resource departments was
requested. Information was requested regarding the AARP lawsuit and its effect on this
issue. Consensus was to review the issue after the committee receives additional
information.
ITEM #6 - Director's Reoorts
The next PAC meeting is scheduled for October 8, 1998.
ITEM #7 - Board Members to be Heard
l'y1ayor Garvey noted the Sunshine Law forbids committee members from discussing
relevant issues outside meetings.
Member Greer recommended the PAC hire its own attorney and requested placing
this issue on the agenda. It was suggested a perceptual conflict of interest exists. Ms.
Dougall-Side's said the City Attorney had provided the PAC a legal opinion that no conflict
exists. The City had hired outside counsel in the Renner case. Concern was expressed
, that attorney had not uncovered a conflict of interest related to the doctor in the case.
Concern was expressed regarding additional costs. Jt was felt as Ms. Dougall-Sides works
for the City, she cannot always look after the best interest of City employees. It was
noted the 'PAC only makes recommendations to the Pension Trustees. More information on
this issue was requested, including if the Legal Department charges the PAC for Ms.
Dougall-Sides' time. It was stated the PAC can take no action regarding this issue as the
Pension Trustees must make the decision.
ITEM #8 - Adjournment
The meeting adjourned at 10:28 a.m.
Chair
Pension Advisory Co
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