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01/11/1996 (2) .' ,',',. .", ". , '" \ '_,: ......,........J....l.~!.... '. ,', .... " " .' '.' .' '. . . '. .' ~'.' ..~. r " i' , , " " ' . .'Il. . , !' . . l, , , "j" . '. . I..;.", , . ~." ..' . . ..:'> '. . ,". J ,. '. . . I'. . 'f i ..."".' ,. "" ~{'.II. ':" .~,.il.i.' > I ,;'.:' , I ~ ;: ! i ~:. :~.:~.,l.!\~ t.;~~{,.~,:, .".~:l'\\ ~~ I .~.. . .t~r > . '" ~ .' '" , : . H. f ~\ . _ . ....~....... .~. ....t J<Ir'l'" ,',,'["l("I":tt~'. \",'.~,. )t'lIt:"'.1 l ./" ",' ." .' '. , PAC Pension Advisory Committee Minutes " .'Date .]G,'~1 " " . . I,' .' . I.. .' ~, . . " I' . , ". I ',." , ,. -' >' '", '..,.,," ..,',",,'\ ",' ,".,,; . . ..':. . ..1,'.'. '..' "'" ,'. '. ....., '. ..~'. ......... : 'I :.'. '.~ '1' , \ " , I .. " -. " 1-:-11 ,,' , . . ' .' '. ~ I' ~..t...I ' ~\ . '. o' \ ( .' ~ t PENSION ADVISORY COMMITTEE CITY OF CLEARWATER January 11, 1996 Present: Rita Garvey Richard Breest Fred Ratley J. B. Johnson Vacant Seats (2) Leslie Dougall~Sides Michael Laursen Jon Marcin Patricia o. Sullivan Acting Chair/Mayor Committee Member Committee Member Committee Member/Commissioner Assistant City Attorney Human Resources Director Risk Management Specialist Board Reporter Absent: Robert Clark Committee Member/Commissioner The Chair called the meeting to order at 9:32 a.m. at City Hall. To provIde continuity for research, items are In agenda order although not necessarily discussed In that order. Item #2 - Aooroval of Minutes (~ Member Johnson moved to approve the minutes of the regular meeting of December 12, 1995, as recorded and submitted in written summation to each member. The motion was duly seconded and carried unanimously. ITEM #3 - Old Business a) William Matlin - Mechanic II, Fleet Maintenance - Job-connected Disability Pension - Not present ~ Case pending b) Leo Thompson - Spray Technician, Parks & Recreation Department - Job-connected Disability Pension -. Not present - Case pending ITEM #4 - New Business a) Claim of Kathy Jenkins on behalf of Latisha Renoe Carey t a minor, for Survivor Benefits as the daughter of Robert Mouzon, deceased. Human Resources Director Michael Laursen referred to the distributed packet of information and indicated additional claims may occur. Assistant City Attorney Richard Hull said the City is aware of two conflicting claims: 1) one dependent child and 2) the estate's representative who has requested the City award the employee's contributions to the estate. Neither has made a formal application. Mr. Hull said staff does not have sufficient information to make 8 recommendation. In answer to a Question, he said the ordinance does not specify an application deadline. o mpac01a.96 1 01111/96 <:. ,.',.\ ". l.'..'........:...,:::..';:l~.:._.::i... ~':'":~-:.":.:}...:~........:.~~..:~............'::~......~.::..~.~;.~'.:~.:......~.....I...I.....:.:..:....: ,t"'\\":' .'. :"." ':. ~,' .... : " ., ,'. "', "'~' ,~ r Consensus was for staff to review the pension for possible claims. b) Request of Robert Lockwood to review the application of actuarially reduced pensions (early retirement provision) Mr. Laursen referred to the January 2, 1996, memorandum from Robert Lockwood, Administrative Support Manager II, Fire Department. Mr. Lockwood said he was speaking for a number of City employees who are concerned regarding the City's proposed application of actuarially reduced pensions to employees retiring at age 65 or above with 10 years of service. He said the new Pension Plan was bargained by the Unions without SAMP input. His concerns are not related to the 1988 legal case. He said older employees deserve fair and equal treatment and pointed out the PAC (Pension Advisory Committee) advises the Pension Trustees regarding which actuary table to use. Mr. Lockwood said the previous plan allowed workers, vested after 10 years of service, to collect full benefits on their 20th anniversary date if they had reached age 55. He expressed concern the new plan cuts these benefits by two. thirds. Workers who retire after 10 years of service receive less than 5 % of their salary as pension and never ate reimbursed their contribution with interest. ~"" .' .L All employees who physically qualify must join the pension plan. Mr. Lockwood said older employees would be better off investing their contribution in personal retirement accounts. He expressed concern older workers are subsidizing the Pension Plan unfairly. He noted seniors appear to be the only group selected for actuarially neutral treatment. He pointed out some Police and Fire Department personnel can retire before 30 years and reaching age 55. Mr. Laursen said the City did not create the Pension Plan. The Plan was a product of collective bargaining with the Unions. He said before the lawsuit was settled, the City's attorney, Debbie Crumbley, had written the law firm representing the older workers in the 1988 lawsuit and explained how the actuarially reduced pension would work. The plan cannot be changed without bargaining with the Unions, followed by a referendum. He said SAMP members were able to provide input to the Plan but did not have a right to bargain it. Mr. Lockwood said the mortality table is harsh and the PAC has the right to recommend the Pension Trustees use a different table. He noted no SAMP members were represented at the Pension Plan negotiations or bargaining. Mr. Laursen said a number of meetings were held with Union and SAMP representatives to build consensus regarding the type of plan employees wanted. Mr. Lockwood said Ms. Crumbley's letter has no bearing as the final judgment does not mention actuary neutrality. He said the Trustees are required to take no action that would unfairly benefit one group at the expense of another. w mpac01 a.96 2 01 /11 196 ,>:;:",;;~,'_:"'" ",',. ';'" .. ',:' ,.".','~".'.. :..:...~,:~':"",\,,:',;,:.:~::.,>,:~',,::~,~,',.,,':~',,':--',:,,',"" ': ~'l:.,~,':<,,:l:';'J'."~'~" "',"", ,.".,,',:" ',:::' ','..,~.:'::.','...' . ',1 " '.' :'.,to:",. ..' . .,1, . ,~I ..' .~. I ~~ .. . l' I: .j .'J, I' : .~ . .,. > \. ~, u. ,~ " " .: ", ' t ,", ,1, '''':~,::..' ,.:,:;..:, ~ """, '. ..: .....,. :'I~ .:.' L I...:;" ':.:. aLi.:> ~ ~".~... .' +. : .. ~~:., ~ ': ': .: ~'" :: ':, : ~ ~.~ '" :< ,: " '; ::' :. ' '.. : <: ... ; ',: ,,:' \'. :(, ,j ': .: : .; :~: " "', ',:,' \' : ,::' ",' , ':"':' ; ':', ~ ~::,' .... :, ", .....: :.\ ~\';: , .: . :' . 'l" ," " '. ~: / :; ~ ':.~ '~ .. ,"'~ , ! Mr. Laursen said suggestions of discrimination will occur always. He noted young people could argue against not collecting a pension until age 55. He said the process is not unusual and is similar to the Pinellas County School Board's Pension Plan. He suggested scheduling Mr. Metz, an actuary, to address this issue. Fire Lieutenant Ed Hooper said under the previous plan, a worker who began work at age 56 and retired at age 65 could not draw a pension until age 75. He noted this plan continues to allow that, but also now allows that worker to receive some earlier recompense, even if it is reduced. He said members of the plan should not bear the burden of improper financial planning by other workers. He said the issue was thought out carefully and discussed at great length. Mr. Lockwood said during negotiations, SAMP employees had requested five times the definition of "actuarially reduced." They were not furnished an example until just before the referendum. He said that explanation was a shock to all. No one expected the resulting payout to be so low. More discussion would have taken place if those numbers had been provided earlier. Consensus of the Committee was to schedule an actuary to address this issue at a future meeting. f+1t Mr. Laursen indicated the actuary, not the City, chooses the actuary table to be used. In answer to a question, he indicated the City hires a number of senior workers for part time and full time positions. Fred Ratley.s resignation Fred Ratlev announced he wiJI retire from his City position and resign from the PAC on February 17, 1996. Election for new PAC members Mr. Laursen said the election process to replace former member Ed Hooper has begun. The election committee decided to include both positions in an election scheduled for lilte Februarv 1996. Nominations are due January 12, 1996. The employee with the highest vote total will be elected to Mr. Hooper's position that expires in June 1997. The winner of the second highest number of votes will take over Fred Ratley's position that expires in June 1996. Special Meeting Mr. Laursen requested scheduling a second January meeting because the large number of retiring employees needs to be addressed promptly. Q mpac01a.96 3 01/11196 "'_' ,..........:;....' ,:,;.,.; ..;:.....:.>i:;(~,.......:.. . .,::J ........>...........:..'>..'...-':./.., , '" I. , ,,'. ' ,,1 "'" .-., I, "I ." "." . . .,..~ I J .. . , , a) Fred Casale ~ Police Officer, Police Department - 20 years of service designation - hazardous duty provision ,~ Consensus of the PAC was to schedule a Special Meeting for January 25, 1996, at 9:00 a.m. It was requested to include the meeting time on the agenda and meeting notice. Nominee Introduction Pat Shepler, Paramedic, introduced himself to the Committee and indicated he is a candidate for a PAC seat. JI.J:M #5 - Review and action on Emolovee Reauests for Years of Service Pension Member Breest moved to approve a Years of Service Pension for Fred Casale. The motion was duly seconded and carried unanimously. b) Elmer Willis, - Mechanic Supervisor, General Services Department - 20 years of service designation - age 56 provision Member Johnson moved to approve a Years of Service Pension for Elmer Willis. The motion was duly seconded and carried unanimously. '~~, f'.~J1 c) Paul Noeske, ~ Police Officer, Police Department ~ 20 years of service designation - hazardous duty provision Member Breest moved to approve a Years of Service Pension for Paul Noeske. The motion was duly seconded and carried unanimously. d) Robert E. Morrison, - Supervisor II, Parks & Recreation Department - 30 years of service designation Member Breest moved to approve a Years of Service Pension for Robert E. Morrison. The motion was duly seconded and carried unanimously. e) Allen H. Edelman, ~ Senior Recreation Supervisor, Parks & Recreation Department. 30 years of service designation Member Johnson moved to approve a Years of Service Pension for Allen H. Edelman. The motion was duly seconded and carried unanimously. f) Ralph Lucas, - Fire LIeutenant, Fire Department ~ 20 years of service designation - hazardous duty provision l' i!~ ~ mpac018.96 4 0111 1/96 ...~.':......, "', ........< <:....~. ....T::-~'~.~:..~..':.:...,..~.~:."'..:I.:..:....I~.I~...+', ':. ..::....:.....,;1:..:,:..:,...:'.',;.'.,.::..:: ..'....;,' .... to""';",:.: " ~. . .... .... , ~ ~.' , " . . , . ! '~C. '. .,. .... :',',,<~,i} ':;:":;',:~',~:' :;~,,:.):, ;'<' ';;' ;:.',:" ,"', :':", , <':: ' \ ' ~'. . ~ ,n , Member Ratley moved to approve a Years of Service Pension for Ralph Lucas. The motion was duly seconded and carried unanimously. ITEM'S - Aporoval of New Members - None. ITEM #7 - Adjournment The meeting adjourned at 10:24 8.m. Bo Ac ing Chair Pension Advisory Committee Attest: ','(:) I' , , '\ o mpac01a.96 5 01/11/96 ;1> , . .... . . ',,: '" :<,:. q: ,>d>:' '\,: :,", '" , _, I \' ',I ""'1 \'--.".J"'" ," I . : , " ~ t .' I ":" . " . . '; '. ~ , ' . '. . ~~ :', .J'_ ': . . t 'J' . , " ',' , ...--... ...........,.... ,