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10/10/1980 . ' ..., I' '. '" ... ' , , .',' ',~. . ~ . ~ : . . '. .~ . ".1 . () ,"-'. FINAL " .' ,i:=. " '..:0 RESOURCE DEVELOPMENT COMMITTEE City of Clearwater, Florida October 10, 1980 I ;' / V Members Present / / '.. .' , , . Elizabeth Haeseker, Chairman Ream Wilson. Parks and Recreation Dept. Donald A. Meerians. Asst. Traffic Engineer Joe Molnar, Fire Inspector (Representing George Buhmeyer) Joseph'Mandy, Asst. Director Utilities (Representing Paul Rettig) David Healey, Planning Director Roy Ayres. Building Department Karen Wilson, Water Resources Specialist (Representing Mike Kenton) Cecil Henderson, Jr., Asst. Director of Public Works John Peddy, Energy Officer .~,' . , . , I' :.:-',': ,"~ ,: - ", .. ,. "Cf ~ I Others Present \ " " John Rooks, Civil Engineer I Terry Jennings, Civil Engineer I 'Bob' Maran, Civil Engineer I John Bastow, George F. Young, Inc. Jim'Krivacs, Dynamic Investments, Inc. Sandy Lloveras, Lloveras, Baur & Stevens Cl i nt Stevens, II II II Jack S~ leeman, Freedom Savings & Loan ~;~: . ,-. r",. ;[;:~'::;[)" ,:r <' '~+'....., ' .r- ." . " l\{' .,. ~t~ ~. ;./ . . ~ f~,;l:" The meeting was called to order by Elizabeth Haeseker at 10:15 AM.inthe Operations Conference Room. .It was decided that beginning in November the Resource Development Committee meetings would be held the 1st Thursday after the Commission meetings due to the 4 day work week. Notices will be sent out. Minutes of the September 12, 1980, meeting were .read and approved with corrections as noted on the original copy. Motion made by Ream Wilson and seconded by John Peddy. Minutes of September 26, 1980, meeting were read and approved with corrections as noted on the original copy. Motion made by Cecil Henderson and seconded by Karen Wilson. * Minutes of the October 3, 1980, special meeting were read and approved with corrections as .noted on the original copy. Motion made by Ream Wilson and seconded by John Peddy. * Dave Healey asked that the minutes incorporate his changes. Do not change but c1 arify. . - 1 - October 10, 1980 II . ~:. i r :'. ~ ~ I ' .' ,- '. ,0 ., . .., ,; ;;:-. r \~;'c .. '. ' ;., \:t ~ . :!;.;'. .~t. . ',.': ' ~" ' 1o..L',: ~~:' . ~. I,'. , . r~.:> . ::;~ " (, . L.'. . ., ~ i';....O.. .~.. ~/.... }~;::. . .- J~{'.,,';,.:,. ~I . . i .f,." , ,': ~,....~ . , ',' " 'I. .,' I " ~ ~ ., " (....:: :" , '~ . ,I ..~ ,.:. :'~ ,.-.- R.D.C. Meeting 10-10-80 - Page #2 ITEM t - Lakeview Oaks, Dynamic Investments; located on a portion of the north side of Lakeview Road between MYrtle Avenue and Ft. Harrison Avenue. COMMUNITY IMPACT STATEMENT Would like to request waiver of CIS. Motion made by John Rooks as to the CIS that since it it is under the amount of CIS and no unique qualities concerned with this that it should be waived under these circumstances. Motion seconded by John Peddy. Motion approved unanimously to grant waiver of CIS. PRELItlINARV SITE PLAN Joe Molnar: No comments. Dave Healey: Don may cover this but we are looking for another 101 of right- of-way on Lakeview Road, or a minimum half right-of-way of 401. That obviously impacts the rest of what happens in terms of sliding it to the north. A couple of minor points on the tabulation of notes - MIL description - light manu- facturing rather than C/G.. Have a question on the parking calculation. Building #1 indicates 5 spaces for staff doctors, 1 doctor 5 spaces, then one space for each additional doctor. What are additional doctors if they aren1t resident doctors? Sandy Lloveras: We took this out of your green book. Dave Healey: Will have to look at this again. Don1t know why a difference in calculations. You probably have enough anyway as you have 88. However, if there are three more doctors and residents you would need 12 additional spaces. Others may raise the question of vacation of rights-of-way. I notice there is an application pending for at least a portion of these easements and rights-of-way to be vacated. Does that application include all of them? I understood that the one along the railroad itself was not to be vacated. John Rooks: That is correct. David Healey: So there would be a problem would there not with what is First Avenue? '.Sandy Lloveras: We took that into consideration. The request went in for vacation of Fir~t Avenue but the staff did not want it, we took that into consideration and set back accordingly in order to agree to that. Dave Healey: What you are showing then is just the way you would improve . that right-of-way to serve your project without any assurance that that configuration that you construct would continue since it ;s in the public right-of-way. - 2 - Oct. 10, 1980 ..,1-.. , ' " ., ~. .:. .;,:::,\:,+~;.:::: ;)':::~:::\':,:~:':.':~; , , \. ,. (. ."', ',., ~.". '.". ,',' :'.'~',: :'/.:; ~.:..'<. i,,~~,~.;'::~.':, : . . . '.:.1 ..~ I.' III ',.., ,:"';:<,,,,;,.:,.'::<'::; ,., ~ :,.' ". ' .,' ,,' '.", '.':: t',. " ..' 1 '~.t"~:;, f:....:~ .":!.", :.;I'~'::';:{ I'~:.:c' I .~.f.;: . ~.\. '''~'. .,L"~l:t,,1 ~.. .~ ".!"!' < . .:,':. :::{;': :>d:>;;'/./ d,."", " .. ,. . .. . .. .; '," .." ., ..:. ..:,~;,it~,)j":}j~~!;,nt!~A;;";;:'i,:i:;~:':>;,::;,t.,.",. ... . . " . . . . , . . ...',. ,.' -" ~,.,.., . ,. .f......... , . 'I ' " t I.":: :~, 'I!::::' :~~~:: ., , . " 'c ( '. . " ;,:/,.,' , ", t. ' '\:'.-:" . F :. .... ',:.: ~.', ..;.., f'.~ ........~. )- . I', "~I. . ~ ''I. I '~ ( . . ,,!.. . ^ I ",'. . , 'I .. , . . ~. , '. .,. ;11, r . -\ ~ . J.. ,. '>.,',' , '," ,. .. 'J' , '. .... '. II ~ , ~ ~~ .:'l: " '.' < . " .,' \ ':/! . ';..:' ..' ,., c' . ~ . , ' . c~ -1-: " ~ . .' ~. ~;)J "1. '. c h' ;'.' ....:.:~ .... "::~:;:::;';.:.i:~.<.~.: .' . f fl... "" " . 'g'~;.':,;:1f;.'.\\;' ~ '.'. . ~. ~' i"" " ' ,<. . ,. J ~ .,>, , I:,", ,,, ,. ',r, \ . ':' .::.:~.} .' '. ...: .: ' . < '.. '. 1-1' c {~:.T .:! '~' '."F"'-: .' ',;::: .~> ,': ':::; c~i'~~ :~ ~ , , "r .I: t. " ~. \, , .' '. ~ \ J: ." '. ." . .. . '-If. ,j ;J'I " ~ IJ .:'. . ,'.:'" /\","""",1:. ..,.' ,'<..'(~'~ : .', ,,' ".' ',.", .~' ',' ,~;'";,,,~','! ','. ~', , ' ~.. ,.', . ,.' . .' "'::, '. ~ .-..., ' _J . ,',~') '. i \....,1 ;..-.... ROC Meeting 10/10/80 'Page #3 ,-, Sandy Lloveras: This is correct. That was what was agreed with Max Battle. Dave Healey: The only other question I have, Don, is the site distance on that eastern most access drive that comes out to Lakeview where Lakev1ew then curves to the north. Wonder if that is sufficient or the best place to bring that out. Karen Wilson: From the tree standpoint, there are a couple of realignments that we are recommending for wildlife and to avoid some fairly large trees. From a water standpoint I think there should be a detention area rather than a retention pond. Would like to see a cross section on this so I can see how deep it is. Do you know what the water table is on the site? Sandy Lloveras: Will have to get back with you on this. Don Meerians: Do you plan to acquire the small chunck of right-of-way which belongs to the DOT? Sandy Lloveras: It is in the process of being acquired. Don Meerians: If we do retain the right-af-way for First Avenue, how are all the things in the code going to be met as far as 51 strip adjacent to the right- of-way line, islands in the right-of-way which we probably would get rid of? Sandy Lloveras: I think the answer to this is that the chances of an actual improvement of this right-of-way ever being put through are very minimal accord- ing to what we are told. I think it is to be left for other utilizations such as drainage or utilities. I think Engineering can probably enlighten us on this. Don Meerians: There is also the question of liability as far as the islands 1n the right-of-way. If someone runs into a tree the City is liable. If we , retain the right of way to First Avenue all the things in the code will apply, such as 5' buffer strips, sidewalks, etc. . . Dave Healey: I assume that would apply. Whatever they are doing in the right- of-way ;s oy way of a temporary nature to serve their project, even though it may be there forever. But as far as the code goes we have to insist on the setbacks and separation distances, etc. They have shown the setback so the only problem ;s the drive itself which is partly on their property and partly in the right-of-way. I don't have any objection to that as long as it is understood that there may be an agreement that we can go in and i~prove that right-of-way. Sandy'Lloveras: We will agree to that because it is your r;ght-~f-way. Dave Healey: The only place it seems to apply is where they have created a drive. Obviously if we build a road in there all of that western most drive will have to be eliminated. They are going to have to have the three points of access to the right-af-way. Dave Healey: To John Rooks - Why did we keep the right-of-way? "John Rooks: The actual reason why it was not vacated to right-of-way easement or utility'easement, I don't really know because I haven't gotten into that' with Max. He told me definitely that'he did not want to vacate the western portion. - 3 - Oct. I ," I ' ,~ , ' , >,. } , .' 'I '" "" I , , ~' , , .' j , , ' .,~ r. ;~ ;':. . I. .. ,. . ',.. j ,. ; ,"'7'- :J '0 . '. .',~," ~' ... . t:': ,',' }:: j, . -! .... ~ :..:- ~, ' I~';~~.':: : '. V,:,. .... . , , , ~< ;, . , ., ~. '- , " . ,. ;,...2) -;.~ .. .' '", . f,.. ' ~~ ' ,> ~1.:: i' - " . (./ :. ~ . ,,'. . , f," '. ""''''. ) ,,-... , ROC Meeting 10/10/80 Page #4 Sandy Lloveras: Max would like to retain that primarily in case that it is ever needed, not necessarily for roads but primarily for possible drainage outfall, sewer or water, or some major improvements and he just doesn't want to give it up. John Rooks: He might not be adverse to making it right-of-way easements which would eliminate setbacks. Sandl L1overas: We tried that, John, and he said IINO". There is no plan for utilization of the road or anything else in the near future so hopefully we can leave as much of that natural area as possible. But if it ever is improved we would agree and have three points of access off that future road at that point. John Rooks: As far as the access on West First, there is a maintenance problem with the road being divided by property line lengthwise. By being in the right- of-way the City would maintain it. Sandy Lloveras: I don't think the City should maintain it - should be like a driveway. Should work out an agreement for maintenance an~ liability. John Rooks: Engineering has agreed to construct a standard 241 roadway which eliminates all the. trees. Roy Ayres: The City cannot contract away its liability, but may be able to accept a II Hold Harmless Agreementtl. . John Rooks: See attachment submitted by Engineering Department. . Any work in the right-of-way of Lakeview would be under the County. DOT turned over to the County. Driveway permits filled out on DOT forms and submitted to . County. You may go blanket easements for water, ingress, etc. 'Roy Aryes: Need to have handicapped parking - it doesn't show on site plan. SidewaTks will have to be put in along Lakeview Road - 51 width. Best way to go on First Avenue is to request a waiver. , " . >-1 Betty Haeseker: Suggest that you get your waiver right away so when you go for your C.O. it will all be taken care of. John 'Peddy: No comment on site plan. Request to the developer and the engineers that any exterior lighting, outdoor, security or otherwise, that the high intensity type lighting be considered in the design as this will fall in line with ,the plan we have for the entire City to go on high pressure sodium or metal halide. Ream Wilson: No Comments. Joseph Mandy: Like to suggest that the lines could be treated as an extension of our water main and that the meters be located along that line rather than have like a manifold that is shown here. This will save you some money. Karen Wilson: We are asking that that line be moved. - 4 - .\' . Oct. 10, 1980 lit '"\ ,. " l > . ~ '. . . . 'I I : . . ' . "'" I. . 1 . , ',' ..... ~ .'. I t"1 .,...1":" " ~. '", "c' . ::,'~ 'I/o .J "" " ~t,: , ;:.,. ' ~.... .', .j:', :'<!' . 'I. , .' . ~ . . ... . I. . ;'>.'0 ;": ., Jf,., , ' . ,', ( i~~~:~.. ~.: ~.:; .', ;';~, ~', ';.,' \ . ~ ' /....'\ , ... ..... ROC Meeting 10/10/80 - Page #5 Joseph Mandy: The actual location of the line that leads to the hydrants we do not care about, it is just suggested that the meters be placed on that line in some convenient location to eliminate the manifold. In this way it will shorten up your service lines from the meters to the buildings. The line that goes to the hydrants will be maintained by the City. Sandy Lloveras: This will be considered a City line? Joseph Mandy: That is right. Joseph Mandy: I don't know what kind of buildings these are going to be as far as consumptlon is concerned so suggest that you make it an 8" line. Put in 111 or l~lt meters if medical buildings. Karen Wilson: If it is an au 1 ine they will have to remove two trees. Discussion: Dave Healey: How would you propose to adjust the things that are represented here with the additional lOr of right-of-way? Sandy L10veras: We learned about this request just yesterday and in conferring with our client he would rather not give the right-of-way. What is the possibility of dedicating the right-of-way but making some agreement for utilization of it? Otherwise mY concern is this. If we have to shift we are going to lose about 3 or 4 trees that we would like to save and lose about . 4 parking spaces. We would prefer not to do that. Our client would like to know what is the possibility of dedicating the lor of right-of-way but agreeing to utilization of a portion of it for parking. Also, we have building #2 on the west side where a problem exists with the setback of that building. , John Rooks: Are these required parking spaces? If they aren't then it could be right-of-way easement to allow parking spaces if they are not required for the site. ' Sandy Lloveras: In all honesty, we need every bit of it. John Rooks: Then they couldn't be counted if they are in the right-of-way easement. Sandy Lloveras: What is the minimum size of a parking space? John Rooks: 19' x 9' - 241 drive. Don Meerians: You are going to wind up short of the required number of spaces. . Roy Ayres: You can pick up 5' on the parking space length as'you have them markea down as 20'. I don't think the shift will interfere with the trees. Karen Wilson: In front of Building #1 you will lose that tree anyway so if you shift everything it doesn't make any difference. - 5 - Oct. 10, 1980 ~~:':;:'.0''': . .; ~ ;\. " ~ I'" I.... ,c\l'. ",> . . ~~?;.:;' . .' IY:'~> . :.~.c :,,",' :", ".: i!"" '. . , , , ....... " . .... Itt,',',;:~:,:. .. ~~~,JI,.. 11 .::'r'T. . I' T~/, '." . . ~ .;;-. .' . ....', , . " 1. . . ~o y .,'~., '. .~ ", ", 'F-I' " . 1/ .. 'l~:: '.' ~ ~ 1 ;.i::...., . , ~~ ~' '.' . . :~r+~<~.. ~':" ',' : ~. .- b: ,:, I . ,. ',. :( ','. .' ~.~ :'.:/..0 il . ~~.>", -'.,. . .. l~,:;::; ...... .. ~:'T'..;" 1 ... < 'if,/..,:"; ;, :;>'.:.~' ,~ ~:~~..'. ':'< ..;)';, :": f:.:...,'. . ::,;.~: . . (\\":.':.. ." t:/..,', ..' ;f~'.",' " . !/,~:..: . ,\.. '.~ L~/., I ' :~.~'i'~' . , . 0." .,', "" . , . , r" ROC Meeting 10/10/80 Page #6 Oon Meer1ans: What is the status of the acquisition of this piece of right- of-way that belongs to the DOT? Sandy Lloveras: Joe Everett, the attorney, is in contact with them. If we are requlred to give a 10. right-of-way it automatically takes care of it. We don't have to get it from DOT at that point because it still becomes a public right-of-way. Motion made by Dave Healey to continue site plan to allow the items that have been addressed today to be included on a revised plan, including the question of the additional right-of~way and an agreement to be prepared addressing the issue of use, future improvement of and non-liability of the First Avenue . . right-of-way. It would be correlated to the approval of the site plan. Seconded by Don Meerians. Dave Healey: By way of clarification, Sandy, what I have in mind is for you to suggest how you could move the thing to comply with the additional 10' ofright~of-way or show us with the right-af-way easement what the alternative might be by way of rearranging the parking or doing something different that would comply with the requirements of the ordinance and allow you to keep that 101 for the purposes of setback, even though you couldn1t count parking spaces. We don't need the actual agreement by the next Commission meeting but try to draft something - a memorandum with your thoughts on how it would work, then .we can get back to our attorney and have it drafted in some formal form so that by the time it goes to the Commission it can also be before them at'the same time. Motion carried unanimously. ".\ ., ,:C i. - 6 - Oct. ,10, 1980 . I .,', L ,r't . , '.' ,,' , ; , . I' ... ~ ,'I., . tl ,'. I . '. l' '.', '. . . o ::8 ' , , .. . 'I' " . i,. . ~ . , .... .(, ',i,..f !~. , . ':;< I~'\ :;'{:"\.~ ,:\i, ~'~.:i'. . ~ 0', ,:. ., . r~'~, I: '< 1" . :;:.:',.".l: . ~ ROC Meeting 10/10/BO Page #7 ITEM 2 - MARLA GROVE ESTATES - L & M Home Builders. Inc.. located on the southeast corner of Cunningham and Allard Drives (in County)~ - PRELIMINARY SUBDIVISION PLAT Dave Healey: Where does your property line on the east boundary adjoin Mr. Cohen's property? Sandy L10veras: Sidney owns everything along the east boundary. Dave Hea1e~: Does he own the property that adjoins you at the very southeast corner? Tnere is a piece of property that has been discussed for annexation that is obviously not his which lies south of that. Sandy L1overas: Sidney owns about another 10001 or 500' south of here. We have contacted Sidney to put Allard Drive through to Belcher Road. Sidney told us to go you know where. . Dave Healey: Can you tell us where that extra 1000' is that you are talking about? Sandy Lloveras: Describes it to them on the site plan. Dave Healey: My concern as I reviewed the layout is the number of double frontage lots. What kind of treatment have you proposed for those double frontage lots? Will the lots along Karen Way face the lake and back up to Allard Drive?, Which way will they join? Sandy Lloveras: There will be a restriction directly on the plat prohibiting driveways entering off both Cunningham and Allard per agreement with the County. However, Cunningham will never be vacated but Allard may. The County has 'no plans to put All a rd through. There is another 40 acres of 1 and directly north of Allard Drive between Allard and Greenbrier that is vacant. The County's initial thinking is to take the road we have on our east side that ties into Allard and run it north into this 40 acres. take all the west road and run it north into the 40 acres, then into Allard at that intersection and the piece in between there will be vacated. Dave Healey: They would not extend it into Belcher? Sandy'Lloveras: No. Dave Healey: What is their thought behind that? Of all the places we need an east-west connector would seem,to be between Montclair and Greenbrier. Terry Jennings: Does Sidney own both sides of Allard Drive? Sandy Lloveras: Yes. That is the problem. Dave Healel: What measures are you proposing to take as part of the sub- division platting process to treat the rear lot line of. the double frontage . 'lots, such as 1'andscapi ng, fenci n9, wa 11 s, etc.? What we don I t want to be - 7 - Oct. 10, 1980 W{T":":;'ji:(::::~.;;~ ~it." . '. . " }". '~".' t J .;,~.,!,l"~:"]' :'1'., ~,~.... ;'.ll,j"I;~';1 '. ,1,..< ,::,: "',',' J... :", " J ~'~.""j'~~';.'l"<J:+"':l'.~,:~':,:::I~""" ,.".:1, ~~'" . ~, '",' ,., /~, t.. ) .,-/ \' ::.....O~~,. , ., ~I' : , . ',. ,'::, 1> ," , . ,,..-..., . ! ROC Meeting 10/10/80 ~ Page #8 ,""'" faced with is that if Allard Drive is constructed and goes through and Cunningham is improved at some later date, we have a series of fences along those rear lot lines. We would like that designed and planned for as part of your platting process, including sufficient depth to accommodate a setback and some firm landscape treatment that doesn't interfere with the utility easements, etc. Sandy Lloveras: We have no utilities along the rear of the lots. The only thing that the County has required from'us is the elilnination of double drive- ways by plat restrictions, which we have agreed to. We have no problem with that. However, no mention until your comment today has been made about berming or fenci n9. ' Dave Healey: Would you have any objection to a conditional plat approval until such time as Allard Drive is, in fact, approved or extended? Sandy Lloveras: That's a problem. Dave Hea1el: Access to the Lake. We have a park site that resulted from the approval of the Cedar Heights subdivision. In our discussion with the property that is going to be annexed to the east of you, which abuts the east end of the lake, we are asking for recreational easement to and over the lake. How can we accommodate within the framework of this subdivision a public access to and on the lake itself? Sand~ Lloveras: We have already provided it. We did not know you wanted it. We d1d it because we felt that people in. this subdivision should have an access to the lake. Were you suggesting an improved access? Ours is not improved. Dave Healey: What we are really asking is access to the lake from Belcher Road. If we had a way to get out on the other end, Cunningham for example, across lot #25, maybe 20. - it doesn't have to be improved, simply a way to get from the road to the water. Sandy Lloveras: Cunningham is in miserable condition and we really do not want to have to go on that road. Dave Healey: The street widths and some of the other standards do not meet . City standards. We need to cOl11llent on this as well as the need to address the park dedication requirement. ' Karen Wilson: Is there any way this retention pond can be made into a dry swale type area? Wet retention ponds of this size. do nothing for water quality whatsoever and you are essentially dumpi~g this stuff straight into Harbor Lake. When this is annexed into the City it is going to become a problem for the City. Sandy Lloveras: It will fluctuate with Harbor Lake. Karen Wilson: Problem is that residents do not want to mai,ntain the pond and expect the City to do so. Is there any way to change this to avoid this problem? Sandy L1overas: You are treating it from a standpoint of water quality. We have also got to treat it from a standpoint of drainage retention calculations. - 8 - Oct. 10, 1980 .. ',"\>':~',,'\ ", '~_._".' ~ ' ':~ :},:.,l't'", ,,:,\, " ,\,"1 . . .",:,~~,...,,~,.,.'.,*,\'~"~:'i.". ',~:I,I::,L:'~~:~;",:~'.I:",::/,. :,~ ~ ,.~\ i ./ "r :,.J ~ .-. ROC Meeting 10/10/80 Page #9 Karen Wilson: That's from a County standpoint unfortunately. From a City standpoint we have design criteria that allow for discharge into the lake. Sandy Lloveras: I know you do but the County does.not. Karen Wilson: That is the problem. This is just going to be a pit full of cattails and mosquitoes - too shallow. I see your problem but if there is something we can do to make that into a dry detention area with gently Sloping sides maintenance will be minimized. Sandy Lloveras: This property doesn1t have too much slope and we may have to lose a lot of lots to accomplish the retention storage capability. We are now having to comply with County requirements and City requirements. This is kind of an unusual subdivision. Karen Wilson: What is this buffer? Sandy Lloveras: Bushes. We are putting subdrains in the subdivision. Karen Wilson~ So what you are saying is that from an engineering standpoint it is not possible to design this pond in any other manner? Sandy Lloveras: Unless we spread it out and lift it up. I would like to get back with you and analyze it. Don Meerians: Do you plan on doing anything to Allard Drive? Sandy Lloveras: Yes, we were but now we are not. Pinellas County Engineering Department will not allow us to pave it. The utility license permit for the County is paving from Cunningham up to our first intersection and we cannot pave the rest of the 'way. Oon Meerians: Are you planning on providing sidewalks any place? Sandy Lloveras: Yes, there will be sidewalks as required by the County on all the right-of-ways. On Allard there is a question mark. The County does . require 'sidewal ks and we probably wi" have to do it by buil di ng permit for Allard Drive. However, I don't know the merits of that so I may ask for a waiver on that.. .Would like to. keep people away fr'om that road. Don Meerians: To Terry. Jennings: What is the minimum width of a public stt'eet? Terry Jennings: 3D' in the City.' These are not 3D' streets. They are 24' back to back. The City also requires a minimum 60' right-of-way. Don Meeri ans : The Ci ty also .'equi r,es a cul-de-sac be designed fa r the City utility trucks. Terry Jennings: The City Engineers recommend that we not object to roadway system as put in by County standards since they have gone this far along in their design in the County. Our comments now will be restricted to alterations to the plan. - 9 Oct. 10, 1980 ~ ::,:':',.;" i; '(J' , , I.: " I ~ I . . ~ - ! ,.: ~ : ' .' . ;'" 1 . ' , . ',' , ' , f' . '. .. ' :';", o"~~~. t'. ~ , \",.1 1,- . ;; >' ,"1. , " 0,', >; . ~,I. ,. I~ ROC Meeting 10/10/80 ~age #10 ,-. Terry Jennings: See attached notes from Engineering Department. 'Roy Ayres: I don1t see any problems but am looking at lots 18 and 20 where the backs of those two lots back up to the side of the other two lots. This may impose some restrictions on rear fences for lots 18 and 20. John Peddy: On your street lighting, 1 propose that they be designed for high pressure sodium to match what we are doing in the City. Don Meerians: We will be providing street lights if they are dedicated streets. Ream Wilson: With the annexation you are aware of requirement for 10% park land dedication. Since the project is only 18.7 acres the net result of dedicated land would be less than 4 acres and, when that occurs, we get into more of a maintenance problem and we accept or require cash in lieu of the land dedication. So, in this case with the 18.7 acre development what the City would be looking for to satisfy the requirement would be 1.87 acres of money in lieu of land, based on either a contract purchase price of the land within the last year or recent appraisal of the property. That figure would be used and the monies would be payable prior to preparing, the ordinance for the purpose of annexation. Joseph Mandy: Would like to make a comn~nt about the cul-de-sacs and the diameter of them. Our concern is that the garbage trucks would have difficulty turning there. Backing up is a problem. We would like to ask that you make them wider. Sandy Lloveras: Did not realize until today that this new standard had come out. You are the only city that has it. Have your people actually measured the , turni n9 radi us of your trucks? Is it because of your system of trucks? Joseph Mandy: Yes. We are looking for 7' or 8' to edge of pavement. Sandy lloveras: The problem we haVe here is that we agreed with Max and as Terry pointed out they are willing to accept the County standards. We have a real problem at this point. I would like to get back with you on this if possible. Joseph Mandy: I have another comment to make about the water system. We would , like to change the diameter of some of the lines starting between lots 27 and 26, we would like to change from 611 to 8" and go 811 up to Allard Drive. ' You are going to have hydrants and the City standard is '811 if you have more than one. The City ~as donated 1300' of material already to reach this property. 'Sandy Lloveras: This is the first I have heard of this. Terry Jennings: This is not true.' This was covered in our letter to you dated 12/13/79. i.I Jose~h Molnar: We are requesting one additional fire hydrant on the'corner of, Lot 1. Will need full coverage on Allard Drive. Would like to relocate one on Karen Way from between lots 40 & 41 to between lots 38 & 39 if it isn1t too difficult. - 10 - '\" Oct. 10, 1980 s{::::":\" :'". ......."':. '. .' . I",. :D'\:-' " ~~:~,:l~~ {~~. '.; : . . . .. ,. . . < :~;'>;"'.:I.. :, ":": .'" [:.:,1?\'<, '~:~{"V' . ~~j)'(~(', ' .. ~r~l.;.'~ '~.:.'. I',' ~~~~......,t,:,;.. ..' .. ... . ~~;' ~.'!~ J: ' " \\ '::., .. " ' " , . t~ : ~.:. " .;. .~., 0 t "." N~ 1 ,. . ~ .' . " i\ ',.~: _' , , 'j:,~~' tfj -......:.J t'.',:::, ,"', ~ ,~~;' '\ : ':{~,'<":.: . .~: < " ,.( .,' , , . -;\.:'\', .> ~~:J'~;':'. '.: t;}\'.:?,:.:.. . "j' "r .", ,. ' ~~~~?: ~',: 0~", , ~.: " . ..; " ~.' .,,- ~~~:;::,:.' . "."...' "ft';.' >,' ~~,:,:'''.c . ~ l 0.. ; n ROC Meeting 10/10/80 Page #11 , ".' l . " r' \ , .\lo..e-MoJnar: We support the 8U lines. Motion made by Dave Healey that we continue consideration of the subdivision plat in order that the fOllowing items can be identified and reconciled. The park dedication and other development impact fees to be established at the time that the City writes its letter authorizing provision of sewer and water service be established. That. there be a recreation and public access either to and over the lake, that there be specific provisions for treatment of the double frontage lots along lots 25 through 32 backing up to Cunningham Drive, that the water lines and hydrants be as specified by the Utilities and Fire Marshall, that the street pavement width and cul-de-sac radius be according to City standards and that the proposed retention area be reworked to the satisfaction of our Environmental section. Motion seconded by Don Meerians. Re~m_WilS9n: In the minutes I had mentioned that payable on the preparation of the ordinance for annexation but I did not realize that 'there would be the water and sewer letter. That will be fine. ,Sandy L.Would like to say that this may be discontinued. I don't believe thatoyrclient is going to ,agree to all of this. Just want to make you aware of that - we may be dropping the entire matter. ..Dave. HealeY.: What do you see as the hangup? , , Sandy L. ldon't believe we can do the cul-de-sac. We have gone too far and we would have to start allover. The contract has been issued and roads ,'are being .cleared. ' ' . .F Be. .Haesek~r:See what you can do, we'll come back and do our best for you. The'motion was to continue it. " , Motion carried unanimously. . ,; .' , - 11 - Oct. 10, 1980 ',' ~ ;1"""'\ ROC Meeting 10/10/80 ~ Page #12 ITEM 3 - FREEDOM SAVINGS & lOAN PRELIMINARY SITE PLAN ,-' ."; Dave Healey: Somebody needs to file a subdivision plat. I think that need falls back on the developer himself. I think they have been advised of that. It is a Commercial Parkway district which technically requires that there be a 20' setback from the lot line since you will, in effect, be creating a separate lot and that would apply to your drive-thru teller station so that on your west boundary you join the parking lot, there is a requirement that the structure be separated by 20' from the lot line. The same thing would apply to the setback from the paved or parking area again, which frankly doesn't make much sense in this instance because your abutting parking there is a 3' separation distance requined between your parking area and your westerly lot linp.. The only other comment I would have and Don may be addressing this as well is that your drive-thru window arrangement doesn't line up with anything. You come out of that facing a parking island here and it doesn't align with any of your parking aisles or drives. It would appear to be very poorly situated in terms of internal traffic flow to the parking lot that abuts you , on the west and that either the rearrangement of your drive-thru system or the adjoining parking east of Albertson's at that point would have to be reworked! I think, to make this a workable arrangement. Karen Wilson: Will defer mY comments to Bob Maran. Don Meerians: How many parking spaces are required. Jack Leeman: I believe it is 17. ,~,:, f'\ (:, ,,~J " Don Meerians: I believe you need to eliminate one space on the west side. To Dave Healey ~ Does that concrete island have to be a certain distance from the property line? Dave Healey: No, I am talking about the narrow drive-thru teller window. Don Meerians: That's going to change that whole concept in that area. Dave Heale~: It will unless they pull the structure back to only the 3rd 'window. They could do that and have just a pass-thru on the outside. Bob Maran: See attached comments from Engineering Department. Roy A~res: Sidewalk will be required along Countryside Boulevard. Approval of the slte plan will not necessarily include approval of the sign on Countryside Boulevard. John Peddl: Would like to recommend to the owner and the engineer that all of your outdoor lighting be of the high efficiency type, preferably sodium vapor. As I won't get' a chance to see the finished plans I would recommend that you see fit to exceed the energy code minimum, especially in the area,of the roof structure and come up with a yield value of about .05 on the system versus the .1 that you are requi red 'by code to offsett some of the anti cipated fenestration area that will exist as it does at most banks. ;.' 'J. ~ ." 'r' . " " ;. . ,.. }:' "0'" ,< \ ..! ' :..:.~, . ~:r' ~ .', ':-. . ..~'i . . . ... .. 12 - Oct. la, 1980